Zemlja "ravna ploča" ili "kugla"?!

Verujem da je zemlja ravna, to vidimo iz božje reči i to su verovali neki naši bogonadahnuti svetitelji



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fr0QM2AM65U
 
Oblik Zemlje je nebitan za pravoslavlje.
 
Nebitno je u smislu višeg cilja, a to je da se propoveda poruka evanđelja. Bitno je u smislu toga što se otkriva mudrost i istina koju treba da obznanjujemo...
 
I u tom smislu je nebitno. Postojali su Sv. Oci koji su mislili da jeste ravna postojali su oni koji su mislili da nije. Astronomski oblik Zemlje nije nikakvo pitanje dogme.
 
Ali je pitanje vere u ono što je Bog napravio.
"Sunce izlazi i zalazi, i opet hiti na mjesto svoje odakle izlazi." Prop 1, 5
 
Ali je pitanje vere u ono što je Bog napravio.
"Sunce izlazi i zalazi, i opet hiti na mjesto svoje odakle izlazi." Prop 1, 5

Ne, nije.
"Pisci koji su o svetu pisali, mnogo su raspravljali o oblicima Zemlje, odnosno o tome da li je Zemlja kao lopta ili kao valjak, ili je možda nalik na diskos koji je odasvud podjednako zaokružen, ili na vedro koje je u sredini šuplje (jer sve te teorije izrazili su oni koji su pisali o svetu, opovrgavajući uzajamno jedni druge). Neću smatrati da je naše shvatanje postanja sveta manje značajno od njihovoga, zbog toga što Mojsije, sluga Božiji, ništa nije govorio o oblicima, i zbog toga što nije rekao da obim Zemlje iznosi osamnaest mirijada stadija; i nije izmerio na koliko se prostora u vazduhu pruža senka Zemlje, kad se Sunce nađe ispod nje; i kako ta senka, padajući na Mesec, izaziva pomračenje. Jer, ono što za nas nema nikakvoga značaja, to je izostavio kao nešto što nam nije od koristi." (Šestodnev sv. Vasilija Velikog).



Uostalom Sv. Pismo kaže da je Zemlja okrugla u Isaija 40:22.
 
"Ako se mogu izmjeriti nebesa gore, i dolje istražiti temelji zemlje, onda ću i ja odbaciti potomstvo Izraelovo zbog svega što počiniše" - riječ je Jahvina." Jeremija 31,37 - ne može se meriti, a oni mere, u zabludu bacaju vasioni svet, treba to da se razotkrije, a tko drugi, nego mi... Dole u primeru kog navodiš piše da je krug, a krug nije isto što i lopta, može da bude, ali može biti i neka ravna površina, a verujemo da je ravna i da ima tako neki krug...
 
Mora da je ravna, jer ako je okrugla, kako bi Isus bio uznesen na nebo? Ne bi imalo smisla. Gdje bi on sada kruzio negdje oko Zemlje. Ovako, ako je ravna, sve postaje smislenije. On je gore, mi smo dolje i to je to.
 
"Ako se mogu izmjeriti nebesa gore, i dolje istražiti temelji zemlje, onda ću i ja odbaciti potomstvo Izraelovo zbog svega što počiniše" - riječ je Jahvina." Jeremija 31,37 - ne može se meriti, a oni mere, u zabludu bacaju vasioni svet, treba to da se razotkrije, a tko drugi, nego mi... Dole u primeru kog navodiš piše da je krug, a krug nije isto što i lopta, može da bude, ali može biti i neka ravna površina, a verujemo da je ravna i da ima tako neki krug...

Konkretno je problem prevoda. U Septuaginti se za Isaija 40:22 koristi riječ gyron γῦρον. Ta riječ ne označava ravnu površinu već zakrivljenje koje implicira sferičan oblik.
 
Mora da je ravna, jer ako je okrugla, kako bi Isus bio uznesen na nebo? Ne bi imalo smisla. Gdje bi on sada kruzio negdje oko Zemlje. Ovako, ako je ravna, sve postaje smislenije. On je gore, mi smo dolje i to je to.

"Eno, dolazi na oblacima, i gledat će ga svako oko, i oni, koji ga probodoše, naricat će nad njim sva plemena zemaljska. Da, Amen." Otkrivenje Jovanovo 1,7
Da je globus, ne bi ga videlo svako oko...
 
"Eno, dolazi na oblacima, i gledat će ga svako oko, i oni, koji ga probodoše, naricat će nad njim sva plemena zemaljska. Da, Amen." Otkrivenje Jovanovo 1,7
Da je globus, ne bi ga videlo svako oko...

Oni će reći da je Bog svemoćan i da će učiniti da ga svi vide.
 
"Tada progovori Isus Gospodu onaj dan kad Gospod predade Amorejca sinovima Izrailjevijem, i reče pred sinovima Izrailjevijem: stani sunce nad Gavaonom, i mjeseče nad dolinom Elonskom." Isus Navin 10,12 - nije rekao stani lopto, nego sunce, dakle, službeni model pada u vodu!
 
Imamo niz svetitelja koji su iznosili učenje o sferičnosti i pokretnosti Zemlje.



Sv. Atinagora Atinski: "Beautiful without doubt is the world, excelling, as well in its magnitude as in the arrangement of its parts, both those in the oblique circle and those about the north, and also in its spherical form. Yet it is not this, but its Artificer, that we must worship." (A Plea for the Christians 16).



Blaženi Avgustin: "Although water still covered all the earth, there was nothing to prevent the massive watery sphere from having day on one side by the presence of light, and on the other side, night by the absence of light. Thus, in the evening, darkness would pass to that side from which light would be turning to the other […] These writers are then asked why Saturn is cold. Its temperature should be higher in proportion to the rapid movement it has by reason of its height in the heavens. For surely when a round mass is rotating, the parts near the center move more slowly, and those near the edge more rapidly, so that the greater and lesser distances may be covered simultaneously in the same circular motion”" (On the Literal Interpretation of Genesis)



Sv. Grigorije Niski: "As, when the sun shines above the earth, the shadow is spread over its lower part, because its spherical shape makes it impossible for it to be clasped all round at one and the same time by the rays, and necessarily, on whatever side the sun's rays may fall on some particular point of the globe, if we follow a straight diameter, we shall find shadow upon the opposite point, and so, continuously, at the opposite end of the direct line of the rays shadow moves round that globe, keeping pace with the sun, so that equally in their turn both the upper half and the under half of the earth are in light and darkness; so, by this analogy, we have reason to be certain that, whatever in our hemisphere is observed to befall the atoms, the same will befall them in that other." (On the Soul and Resurrection).



Sv. Anastasije Sinait: "So for the present, there will be no discussion from us about forms, intervals, rotations, motions, cycles, stasis and change, orbits, the Antipodes, the calculations of heaven and Kronos, the axis of the stars, astrology, the speed of the sun, Fate, or the moon’s phases and motions and eclipse; nor about the constellations and the individual stars observed in them; nor about tides and floods, from which also earthquakes are brought against a place – or so they fantasize, they who are trained in this mathematical and random science. The Church has been rescued from these endeavors, as from a thoroughly devastating disaster, by the Word, which dwells in all and is true. For if the Church discovered every movement of the sun and moon and heaven and earth and winds and stars – what gain would it enjoy, except only a transient and deceptive glory?" (Heksameron).



Sv. Grigorije Palama: "You should know how far below (from our viewpoint) the centre of the earth lies the centre of the sphere of water, if you bear in mind that the surface of the water visible to us and beneath us, just as the ground of the earth we walk upon, coincides almost exactly with the surface of the terrestrial sphere which we inhabit. Our habitable portion of the earth is about a tenth of its circumference, for the earth has five zones, and a half of one of these five is inhabited by us." (150 Chapters).



Sv. Jovan Kronštadski: "Zemlja je tvrda i troma, premda se i kreće oko sunca vrlo brzo. Voda je tečna i brza, usled čega i govore – brzak. Vazduh je još ređi, tananiji i brži, usled čega se kreće vrlo brzo, na primer u vetrovima. Svetlost je još tananija i brža, te u jednoj sekundi prelazi neverovatno veliko prostranstvo. Kako tek treba da je lagan i brz stvoreni duh? Najzad, kakav li je tek nestvoreni Duh – sam Gospod?" (Moj život u Hristu).
 
Imamo niz svetitelja koji su iznosili učenje o sferičnosti i pokretnosti Zemlje.



Sv. Atinagora Atinski: "Beautiful without doubt is the world, excelling, as well in its magnitude as in the arrangement of its parts, both those in the oblique circle and those about the north, and also in its spherical form. Yet it is not this, but its Artificer, that we must worship." (A Plea for the Christians 16).



Blaženi Avgustin: "Although water still covered all the earth, there was nothing to prevent the massive watery sphere from having day on one side by the presence of light, and on the other side, night by the absence of light. Thus, in the evening, darkness would pass to that side from which light would be turning to the other […] These writers are then asked why Saturn is cold. Its temperature should be higher in proportion to the rapid movement it has by reason of its height in the heavens. For surely when a round mass is rotating, the parts near the center move more slowly, and those near the edge more rapidly, so that the greater and lesser distances may be covered simultaneously in the same circular motion”" (On the Literal Interpretation of Genesis)



Sv. Grigorije Niski: "As, when the sun shines above the earth, the shadow is spread over its lower part, because its spherical shape makes it impossible for it to be clasped all round at one and the same time by the rays, and necessarily, on whatever side the sun's rays may fall on some particular point of the globe, if we follow a straight diameter, we shall find shadow upon the opposite point, and so, continuously, at the opposite end of the direct line of the rays shadow moves round that globe, keeping pace with the sun, so that equally in their turn both the upper half and the under half of the earth are in light and darkness; so, by this analogy, we have reason to be certain that, whatever in our hemisphere is observed to befall the atoms, the same will befall them in that other." (On the Soul and Resurrection).



Sv. Anastasije Sinait: "So for the present, there will be no discussion from us about forms, intervals, rotations, motions, cycles, stasis and change, orbits, the Antipodes, the calculations of heaven and Kronos, the axis of the stars, astrology, the speed of the sun, Fate, or the moon’s phases and motions and eclipse; nor about the constellations and the individual stars observed in them; nor about tides and floods, from which also earthquakes are brought against a place – or so they fantasize, they who are trained in this mathematical and random science. The Church has been rescued from these endeavors, as from a thoroughly devastating disaster, by the Word, which dwells in all and is true. For if the Church discovered every movement of the sun and moon and heaven and earth and winds and stars – what gain would it enjoy, except only a transient and deceptive glory?" (Heksameron).



Sv. Grigorije Palama: "You should know how far below (from our viewpoint) the centre of the earth lies the centre of the sphere of water, if you bear in mind that the surface of the water visible to us and beneath us, just as the ground of the earth we walk upon, coincides almost exactly with the surface of the terrestrial sphere which we inhabit. Our habitable portion of the earth is about a tenth of its circumference, for the earth has five zones, and a half of one of these five is inhabited by us." (150 Chapters).



Sv. Jovan Kronštadski: "Zemlja je tvrda i troma, premda se i kreće oko sunca vrlo brzo. Voda je tečna i brza, usled čega i govore – brzak. Vazduh je još ređi, tananiji i brži, usled čega se kreće vrlo brzo, na primer u vetrovima. Svetlost je još tananija i brža, te u jednoj sekundi prelazi neverovatno veliko prostranstvo. Kako tek treba da je lagan i brz stvoreni duh? Najzad, kakav li je tek nestvoreni Duh – sam Gospod?" (Moj život u Hristu).

Neki su tako verovali jer su bili pod utjecajem pojedinaca iz prijašnjih vremena, ne treba ih kriviti. Mi zato imamo mudrost i sigurnost i čvrst stub u našoj crkvi koja se treba boriti protiv takvih hereza u znanosti.
 
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